RE: The Stupidity of Hivewatchers
(Edited)
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The database of abusive accounts has largely been corrupted into near worthlessness by @logic's poor logic regarding abuse. I see automated @spaminator downvotes on posts from some of my favorite (non-abusing) users.
Is there some way to automate that?
Or, maybe it's time to find new management?
That daily grind is something that requires a special temperament, but that temperament has to have somebody ride herd on it, or the power goes to its head, in my experience.
I'd like to see the Hivewatchers proposal unfunded until logic finds a job better suited for him. Abuse may increase temporarily but the void of anti-abuse won't be unfilled forever. I've long said that Hivewatchers needs to fire him, or Hive needs to fire Hivewatchers.
Who replaces him?
Not many willing to do that job, that I can see.
Can we get a proposal to manage the abusive account list from somebody capable of doing it?
I'm seeing more a lack of alternatives than any real support from 'the community'.
Absent a viable alternative I wouldn't be in favor of doing without, there is a real need in the hive for what is being done.
I do favor more active voices in the anti-abuse community, though.
There has been far too few of us for far too long, iyam.
There has been a lot of abuse by anti-abusers. It takes a special bird not to be feathered by it's flock.
Power corrupts.
I refute this. Rather, the corrupt seek power.
I was handed power, a few times, I was not up to the responsibility, but I recognize that now, and no longer seek power.
No doubt the corrupt do love them some power.
Can you join this room: https://app.element.io/#/room/#hivediscord:matrix.org?
@amaterasusolar was dissatisfied with your treatment of her, and I would like to see the differences further discussed.
I am aware. I am not responsible for the beliefs of others. I provided factual evidence and they managed to avoid addressing it. I do have things to do that have the potential to benefit good people, and beating my head against the brick wall of someone that refuses to see what is plainly visible isn't one of them.
I appreciate your good concern for your friends, but am confident that you also can profit by restricting yourself to discourse that features mutual agreement as to demonstrable facts.
If you are aware of our discussion you will have observed I plainly and repeatedly requested them to quit. I expect you to be able to imagine how you would consider your request of me were it made of you in that circumstance.
Edit: I realized belatedly I failed to point out that my comment did not mean that everyone that seeks power, or finds themselves with it, has nefarious purpose. We have spoken before of your participation and I am satisfied you have duly considered my thoughts on the matter, and take actions you decide are proper.
I checked out of the conversation as tldr, which was what prompted my attempt to get a rehash in chatroom.
It's private, encrypted, and off chain.
I'll leave it to ya'll to drop or gnaw, as you wish.
One of the things I like best about Hive is that our posts are public, and uncensorable.
I have endeavored to exit that conversation without muting, because I am averse to censorship, and particularly censorship that eliminates information I am availed. I have managed to move on, and that is exactly what I have sought.
Your favourite users are arrogant, self-entitled abusers. Most of them are also as vulgar in their language and insults as you. You are now being muted.
Did you get this comment under the right person?
Says the arrogant asshole who will lose his sorry little ass very soon. Tsk Tsk
Excellent! now the assless asshole won't know what butchered his sorry little ass. LoL
I had no idea I was an arrogant, self-entitled abuser.
There must be more to life.
Hahahaha, ¡Search & Learn!
That may be, in that case, let's have an alternative competing proposal to consider.
I don't consider a free for all with no one putting in the time to identify and push back on systematic extraction (even if necessarily imperfectly to some degree or another) to be an attractive alternative.
People not liking it and raising objections basically goes with the territory. Everyone wants free reign to grab their piece of the pie without pushback, some reasonable some not. Too bad, free reign is a disaster.
And let's be clear about one thing. Regardless of whether you happen to like how it is being handled now, the vast majority of the (small in any case) user base is not affected. People can and do post and comment on all sorts of reasonable things and never get any attention or notice from anti-abuse efforts. We hear from the complainers, not the majority who are unaffected (except in so far as they benefit because the reward pool is preserved for them to some extent, with rampant abuse it wouldn't be)
I can't see not having a searchable, collective memory of the 'naughty' accounts and the details of that determination being open for appraisal.
How can we track large fraud schemes without this kind of database?
I continue to support @logic and hw's until a viable alternative is in place.
That's largely my view without getting into the weeds of how it works since I don't follow the specifics in detail. If there is an alternative making a pitch, I'll consider supporting it instead, or in addition to let them run side by side for a while and compare performance. If the alternative is nothing, then I don't support that.
I recall @themarkymark had a competing idea at one point but was shut down because the stakeholders thought it too excessive for the number of active users and favored HW instead.
This is the problem. Nothing will change because people like Logic know he won't be booted. It's basically holding the chain hostage for their supposed "indispensability".
There were days when HW had to pause operations due to "funding" and the chain didn't implode.
@smooth
There are good people in hive watchers from the ones ive met.
having said that, my initial experiences with them made me feel targeted and actually made me concerned that I was being targeted by a criminal group or harassment. At the end of the day they are people, and fallible. Always will be.
From my personal experience, it strongly made me consider leaving the entire hive ecosystem. The problem I think lies in that the hivewatchers are not HR reps trained to deal with all different types of people and the way that one person expresses something can be totally misinterpreted by various types.
Ive long thought on this, since this happened to me about a year ago.
An adjustment of some form to the system is needed. After brainstorming on this for a year, my best idea is crowdsourcing it.
IF any person flags a post as spam, plagiarism etc. they submit proof of their claim if plagiarism and use citations, or explain their case in the situation of spam or farming. Then let everyone on hive scroll through these situations on a kind of news reel feed, and optionally, give people who perform the service of verification some reward in hive or hbd, they will review the post that was flagged and the case of the reporter and vote thumbs up or thumbs down, if thumbs down on any case reach some threshhold, say 30%, the post has no reduction of rewards. If 70% thumbs up and agree with case of reporter, then all hive rewards from post are removed and vote power can or can not be returned to voters up to u.
Maybe limit accounts to 10 or 20 verifications a day, and 3 reports a day. you can reward a reporter at end if case gets thumbed up.
maybe some type of proof of humanity can help, id do this even for free and im not in hivewatchers, a captcha, idk up to u.
ill think more on it. \
best wishes, there MUST be a better way, systemically
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